[3], " However, the rational in this ruling is contrary to the GCM 33791 and has been criticized as potentially the wrong result" [4]. An unreferenced PLR that was withdrawn and not published isnt any help. Tangible personal property includes a wide variety of equipment, from small office fixtures to light trucks and buses. So are ETFs that invest in gold bullion. Consider property such as furniture, machinery, cell phones, computers, and collectibles which can be felt compared to intangibles such as patents, copyrights, and non-compete agreements that cannot be seen or touched. Ways to Invest in Gold One-Time Checkup with a Financial Advisor, personal property that isnt considered real property, Compare Up to 3 Financial Advisors Near You. I don't think existing (authoritative) guidance adequately address the gold coin. and there is no way you can either make a currency distinction between US and Canadian coins. . An article written by someone isnt guidance; its someones opinion. You have seriously never heard of non-correlated investments? And that is the position of every state that imposes a sales tax. A lock icon ( Per Rev Rul 69-63 the IRS ruled that gold coins that do not have any numismatic value are more akin to money that therefore are not considered tangible personal property for donation purposes. Tangibles can have considerable financial value . If you want to see the fallacy of "more akin to appreciated stock" check out the treatment of a donation of units in a publicly traded ETF holding gold bullion. They are probably the bullion coins authorized by Reagan. How about finding a source that thinks the PLR *wouldn't* be affirmed? I researched this some and could not find a definite answer. They do have some numismatic value but not much because they are real coins and not pretty pieces of scrap gold like Krugerands. [citation needed]In English law and some Commonwealth legal systems, items of tangible property are referred to as choses in possession (or a chose in possession in the singular). Hmmmm. Is a dollar, or a penny or a dimeproperty? Part of the problem, as I see it, and as noted a few times, is that we're dealing with a law (charitable contribution of tangible personalty) that came before the Gold Bullion Coin Act of 1985. 2023 McNamee Hosea. The IRS concluded that South African Krugerrand gold bullion coins were not personal property for purposes of IRC 170(a)(3). Heres why. Let's say I hold a stock that I've held over a year. Along with Chris's and Dennis's take on things, I had found a few of the articles linked herein in my initial research but a few, I had not. It is obvious that the IRS has had some trouble with it too. 1)Does the client get the bullion value of the gold as a charitable donation deduction (i.e. Thank you both Chris and Dennis for your insight. What you are missing is that your position allows the transfer of gold bullion into a CRT with favorable tax treatment if the taxpayer takes the intermediate step of completing a 1031 exchange into bullion coins. Therefore, the Will should make clear what the intent is concerning the distribution of the box and the items in the box. If its determined to be cash, then the collection should be bequeathed through the Will, which you must sign along with two witnesses, and which must be notarized. Other considerations You ever dealt with a donation of non-numismatic coins? It includes furniture, fixtures, tools, machinery, signs, equipment, leasehold improvements, supplies, leased equipment and any other equipment used in a business. We do not manage client funds or hold custody of assets, we help users connect with relevant financial advisors. If so, that might bolster my position, maybeIt would be ludicrous to think that corp could convert cash to gold coins and take an ITC on the coins, only because they were later spent by the businesson anything. Ckenefick and Dennis, watching you debate over this is certainly entertaining, but I dont think its been very helpful to the OP. In these cases, it may be better to direct that these more valuable items be sold and the Will would direct how the proceeds of the sale are to be distributed. Foreign currency is not "money". 2008). My client says they are 1.0oz $50 American Eagles. Experienced Estate Planning Attorney, Elga A. Goodman, can help you with all your estate planning needs. For large amounts of gold, other delivery options will need to be explored, such as delivery directly to a dealer. Therefore, since PLR 9225036 concluded that gold bullion coins were not personal property for purposes of IRC 170(a)(3), we can safely take a position on a return that a client may claim FMV (not cost basis) for a donation of those coins. Phone: 888-497-4970info@pgcalc.com, Calculate and illustrate all planned gifts, Create gift annuity proposals and agreements, Help with bequest administration software, Report service and actuarial verification, Illustrations for clients without software, Our commitment to diversity, equity, and inclusion, Capital gains tax savings (28% x $130,500), Net cost of gift ($161,500 - $10,850 - $36,540), Capital gains tax savings (28% x $50,501), Net cost of gift ($161,500 - $4,199 - $14,140), Net cost of gift ($161,000 - $6,003 - $36,540). In OP's case, I think we fail the test b/c coins will be immediately sold. They certainly don't "for purposes of" 408(m) - and I wonder why? It goes over the subject but does not get into the nitty gritty, leaving one to wonder. For planning purposes, it is best to condition the gift of the firearm to a beneficiary who can establish his or her right to receive and carry a weapon. Cambridge, MA 02138 Tangible property is property which occupies physical space. Rul. The value of tangible personal property may range from very nominal value e.g., old pots and pans to considerable value, for example, art, stamps and coins, gold bullion and gold and silver bars. The Regan era coins are tangible personal property that can included in the Estate of a Non-Resident Alien. Sounds like you should ask the charity to clarify exactly how the gift should be properly reported on a tax return. The bullion value at the time of the donation is 40K and the charitable organization immediately sells the coins (unrelated use for the charity) . gold, silver, or numismatic coins of any value; iii. Tangible personal property includes fixtures attached to real estate if . Thus they appear to be USC Title 37 5112(a)(7) coins. General consensus is that PLR 9225036 was about to be reversed by another PLR that was not issued because the applicant died and that it is unlikely it would hold. The best you might do with this argument is avoid preparer penalties. Aaah, maybe the IRS thinks *this* type of "personalty" is different than *other* types of "personalty" so they apply a special rule to it. It just fleshed out the history of the cases and the facts, with a few observations here and there. 0 items. As a result, you may end up with a loss. But, as things stand now, you're right. You make no sense. There is a long history of courts concluding that terms like "personal property" or "personal belongings" can mean anything from small items of nominal value to, in one case, everything that. It describes a wide range of items used in the course of conducting business or for operating a rental property. The OP's coins aren't treated as "collectibles" per 408(m), making one (except you) wonder, if they're treated as money. This is because this type of property usually does not increase in value over the years. Usually this is not much of an issue, since there are no title documents for most of your personal effects, and your intended beneficiaries can just collect, disperse and/or sell the contents of your house. Of course, you said, "bull," which just goes to show you didn't see the link between OP's coins and 408(m)and you didn't fully understand the true nature of OP's coins. But the objections to the PLR are more than just "someones opinion." Your position then is that my example stands. 5739.01(DDD). After all, that's what most people do when they write checks to charitable organizations. An unreferenced PLR that was withdrawn and not published isnt any help. And somehow you figure 170 is going to be different? You dont want your bequests to result in disputes among your heirs or in court proceedings because the items were not gifted in a legally correct manner. When boats or cars are still subject to a lien, these items will need to be sold in order for the title to be transferred out of the decedents name. The property type doesn't matter. I don't dispute that and never have. Conversely, if the chandelier is to remain attached to the real property . Cryptocurrency is not "tangible property" because it cannot be touched; instead, it exists . You want to take the opposite position, but you have nothing but hearsay to rely upon. The retail classification is comprised of the business of selling tangible personal property at retail. Rul. Since the gain in all of these items when sold is taxed at the rate applicable to tangible personal property (up to 28%), you may wonder why there would be any doubt about their deductibility. Give me a cite that speaks specifically to U.S. gold coins minted under the Reagan act. This shouldnt be an issue for gold bullion, which is readily marketable, except perhaps when funding occurs at the very end of the year). The term intangible personal property refers to an item of value that cannot be touched or physically held. So are ETFs that invest in gold bullion. Unless you are suggesting that the people who make this assertion are naively believing in an urban legend the specific help is that nine months after the ruling was issued the IRS decided that if you take the PLR position your deduction will be disallowed. 120, par. A letter from the property appraisal office will usually be sent by mail to the company notifying it to file taxes on its property. If I'm right on the ITC, and I'm not saying I am, it's another example of guidance not contemplating a new asset class. 20.2104-1(a)(2)has always included the contents of a safety deposit box. Then we'll put the coins in an "account" and transfer the account to charity. The Regan era coins are collectibles. A related use would be, for example, a gift of gold coins that will be retained and displayed by a numismatic museum. That might work best for you. Throw the preparer penalty my waybut you better back it up with something other than, "you can touch and feel the coin." 1.170A-13(c)(2). Some counties and cities require the filer to list all property on the tax form and to provide the fair market value and cost for each tangible property. "Collectibles" is a term of art to designate something subject to a special 28% tax rate, or something that can't go in an IRA. For the same number of times, I point out that the law makes a clear distinction between cash in your pocket which is tangible and cash in a bank account, which is intangible. My mind is closed from the standpoint that I do not believe we should always apply old paradigms to new issues. A ruling on the Canadian Maple Leaf does not apply to US minted gold coins Investopedia does not include all offers available in the marketplace. A tangible personal property list can be used to transfer a broad array of personal property, with the exception of money, coin collections, and property used in trade or business. Just an observation. And I'm sure you would submit the charity's letter as evidence. The law also (in all cited cases) makes a clear distinction between currency value and market value. Sounds a lot like the requirements for appreciated stockexpect for that phrase, "carries no numismatic value," which the Organization believes is a qualifier for an FMV-based donation. Sure, it would be easy to do that, but I'm not so sure its appropriate. Rul. We have a basis of 12 cents and a value of 15 cents. Alcohol The transfer of valuable wine collections or other alcohol is governed by state law and may require a license. Then comes the law. Code specific to exchanges, no? Share sensitive information only on official, secure websites. Period." There are no guarantees that working with an adviser will yield positive returns. Assets like property, plant, and equipment, are tangible assets. Finding a qualified financial advisor doesnt have to be hard. Household furnishings, books, tools, jewelry, motor vehicles and boats are some of the items which fall into the category of tangible personal property. The property appraiser places a value on the property, and the tax amount due is calculated by multiplying the property value by the tax rate set by the tax authorities in the state. Tangible personal property represents anything that may be used like a desk, bed, lamps, or other furnishing for a rented home or business. One option is to itemize such specific bequests in a Will. The "gold masters" allowed the corporate mainframe to communicate directly with the store computers. The owner purchases shares in a company that is mining gold, rather than gold itself, with the expectation that the mining company and its share price (or the share price of the ETF that invests in such companies) will prosper when the price of gold goes up. Please limit your input to 500 characters. Please limit your input to 500 characters. I myself don't think the parsing, which is clearly going on in Sec 170, absolutely contemplates all types of property, especially in light of the U.S. Government getting back into the gold minting business. For charitable purposes, if treated as "money," the deduction would be 10 cents. It's really a muddled thing with legal tender gold coins: there's cost, face value and real value. R.C. When investors become skittish about the economy, many of them sell their publicly-traded securities and buy gold. We have Congressional intent. Appraisal Method. Note: You are using this website at your own risk, subject to our, http://www.aicpa.org/publications/taxadviser/2013/january/pages/clinic-story-07.aspx, http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/Discussion:Donation_of_Gold_Coins, Lacerte Professional Tax Preparation Software, Newsletter for Accounting & Tax Professionals. And, if it's unresolved, we look to other things that might give us hint as to the right answer in the charitable context. If it was, it would have said, "The taxpayer did not hold the coins as a medium of exchange. Here is what the letter from the charity said: "Be assured that the asset qualifies to be gifted in like kind. Going down the 1031 path will get us nowhere in this inquiry. Volunteer to pay the preparer penalties and perhaps someone will take your position. Among these three metals, gold and silver are preferred over platinum, which is quite volatile as an investment. Retail classification; definitions. Might want to read this too, about how uber important state law characterization is with respect to 1031 exchanges Held, since the collection of rare coins was not held primarily as a medium of exchange. That's not the OP's case. In a Florida estate some gold coins were listed on a probate inventory listing supplied by the estate trustees and lawyers. No exemption is available for distribution made in accordance with a Will or a Trust. (Note that gain reported under the four-tier system for taxing unitrust payments will be taxed at 28% until all gain attributable to the bullion has been distributed). The only states that exclude tangible personal property from taxation altogether are: The process of levying taxes on tangible personal property varies wildly from one state to the next, and may even vary between different counties and local municipalities. Most charities don't say much more than "Thank you. In comparison to intangible personal property, tangible property can be touched. The piano that you own, which you utilized to write the song, is considered tangible personal property. A gift of physical gold, be it bullion or coins, means you have to worry about how you will take possession of it. Often, a Will will leave all such tangibles to a spouse or to children. And I do realize that we might not win this one to begin with. Shall we start a thread about *Bitcoin?*. h. Manufactured or mobile homes purchased in or delivered from another . And whose to say what OP's holding purpose was? Is a coin collection considered to be cash or personal property (state if MA, if that makes a difference) Ask an Expert Ask a Lawyer Estate Law DISCLAIMER: Answers from Experts on JustAnswer are not substitutes for the advice of an attorney. Working with an adviser may come with potential downsides such as payment of fees (which will reduce returns). Gotcha. Shares in a specific gold mining company or in an ETF that invests in them are considered securities for tax purposes, like shares in any publicly-traded company. 408(m). For reference, the unfavorable tax treatment can be found in. Tangible personal property taxes are typically assessed at the state level, though they may be dictated by county, city or local municipality. Circulating, from what I can tell, even though the word has never been adequately defined. With the gold market perhaps beyond its peak and ever volatile, some of these donors may be ready to put the value of their gold to good use by making a charitable gift. "Tangible personal property" is defined in General Laws Chapter 64H, Section 1(15) as, "personal property of any nature consisting of any produce, goods, wares, merchandise and commodities whatsoever, brought into, produced, manufactured or being within the commonwealth, but shall not include rights and credits, insurance policies, bills of exchange, stocks and bonds and similar evidences of indebtedness or ownership.". Maybe, but we're not talking about sales tax. They come from abandoned safe deposit boxes held by financial institutions, evidence from police departments, and various other entities such as colleges, hospitals and nursing homes. An official website of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, This page, Letter Ruling 83-28: Gold Coins, is. That's why I like the "akin to an appreciated stock" argument better. So for example, while a parent may state in her Will that her estate should be equally divided between her two children, she may attach a statement specifying that. ? As such, those definitions and categorizations we use for other purposes of the Code, like realization, shouldn't necessarily be extended to Sec 170 with no questions asked. (Allowed only when the bullion is sold. To avoid any confusion as to what a person considers to be the tangible personal property a Will should include its own definition of that term and specifically carve out of that definition any items that the person may want to leave specifically to one or more persons, or perhaps fall in the typically larger rest and residue provision of the Will. This is how all the cases come down on it on the recognition side. 43, sec. on the income tax issue (realization) treats it as tangible personal property. Tangible personal property is always depreciated . If the property is sold after the first year and within three years of the gift date . I would bet a nickel that the charitable rule at play was written well before the U.S. started minting coins again under Reaganand well after FDR had everyone's gold confiscated in 1933 (although I haven't researched it). Personal-use property. You skipped the table of contents section. Often, a Will will leave all such tangibles to a spouse or to children. A tangible asset is an asset that has a finite, transactional monetary value and usually a physical form. What's interesting, these cases go to court because someone has used these coins in commerce, to pay wages, or to receive payment, but the courts say the coin type was "non-circulating." The only specific example of tangible personal property for charitable contribution purposes found in the regulations involves a gift of a future interest in a chandelier that is attached to a building. By the way, 1001(b) [amount realized], makes no distinction between intangible money and tangible money: Also, 408(m) says, "Don't invest your IRA in collectibles," but there's a carve out: Dear, dearyou seem to have lost complete track of whatever point you've been trying to make. Is money considered tangible personal property? The more information one can obtain regarding an issue, the better. This has certainly been the case over the last ten years. This might not be what you could actually sell it for today. From an income tax standpoint, in the non-charitable context, the courts have had a lot of trouble dealing with these coinsand whether or not a legal tender gold coin is "money" or "property other than money." 2 & Ch. Any other tangible personal property that the IRS determines is a "collectible" under IRC Section 408 (m). And if they're circulating, guess what: They constitute money under the courts' own test. Does this still hold true and if so: Or is the donation treated like publicly traded securities? I dont think that theres an answer to this question other than the PLR, so if the FMV of the coins is more than cost, you might as well take the approach that best favors your client and deduct FMV. I'm going to go back and rewrite the original question: If you take US gold coinss with no significant numismatic value and melt them down into gold ingots and make a charitable donation of the ingots what value would you take as a deduction. Certain individuals are prohibited from being gun owners, for example, a person convicted of a crime or who has been adjudicated mentally defective, a fugitive, an illegal alien and anyone who has received a dishonorable discharge. But 170 falls short in the "personal property" arena. That which may be felt or touched, and is necessarily corporeal, although it may be either real or personal (eg ring or watch)." Please let us know how we can improve this page. Trustee compensation should be specified. Therefore, sales of such coins for delivery in Massachusetts are subject to the Massachusetts sales or use tax. The asset appraiser will assess the current condition of the assets, including the degree of obsolescence and level of wear and tear. But it doesn't really matter. If you take the position it is in error, the obligation to show otherwise is on you. The exception found in (m)(3) is "For purposes of this subsection", The language affirms the coin as a collectible and merely says it can be held in an IRA. As mentioned, tangible personal property is anything that can be touched, moved or consumed, with the exception of real property (real estate) and intangible assets with a recognized value (stocks, bonds, patents and the like). You might not care for State sales tax law but the consistent use of this language has to have meaning. On the realization front, which would include 1031 in my view, Section 61 is broad and easy. And, you can change your mind about who will receive the coins as often as you like. Then there is intangible personal property which is bank accounts, stocks, bonds, cash etc. How Much Do I Need to Save for Retirement? In most states, a business that owned tangible property on January 1must file a tax return form with the property appraisal office no later than April 1in the same year. I didn't mean to cause/create any rifts! Tangible personal property is a tax term describing personal property that can be physically relocated, such as furniture and office equipment. Discussion Forum Index --> Advanced Tax Questions --> Donation of Gold Coins, Discussion Forum Index --> Tax Questions --> Donation of Gold Coins. contact the Massachusetts Department of Revenue. Greenbelt, Maryland 20770 This means that taxes are assessed according to the items perceived fair market value. Not that it matters, because we have the "for purposes of" language in the ruling. The selection of managers and experts to deal with these types of animals should be made well ahead of time and communicated so that the care plan can be implemented immediately upon ones demise. Ah. Sure would be nice, by the way,if you could find some kind of opinion supporting the logic of the PLR. her pearls go to her favorite niece, Alice. So, that's all I know. In my opinion, that's no proof at all. The value of tangible personal property may range from very nominal value e.g., old pots and pans to considerable value, for example, art, stamps and coins, gold bullion and gold and silver bars. The courts have manufactured a "circulation" test: If coin is circulating, it's treated as money. Of course, the word "money" isn't defined in the Tax CodeI made that point too, Dennis, but maybe you missed it. Rev. This is why a dime, if circulating, is not treated as "property other than money" under the tax code. Property owners who lease or rent tangible personal property must also file this return for tax purposes. The bullion value at the time of the donation is 40K and the charitable organization immediately sells the coins (unrelated use for the charity) . Gold coins and gold bullion are considered collectibles for tax purposes. In the case of a disabled beneficiary, it may be best to exclude the individual from receiving the items altogether. We go by face value. South African Krugerrand coins are more akin to money than to coins that have value as collections items. Collectibles are taxed as capital gains or losses similar to stocks and bonds but with one very important exception. Definition and How It Works, What Is a Fixed Asset in Accounting? Legal Tender. SmartAsset does not review the ongoing performance of any Adviser, participate in the management of any users account by an Adviser or provide advice regarding specific investments. He can then donate the same value but get favorable tax treatment under the PLR. PLR 9225036 is the only relevant guidance here. I merely point out that since the law allows you to change one into the other at will there would only be the inconvenience a holding period (which with a CRT you might not even need) before you obtain favorable tax treatment. The subject but does not get into the nitty gritty, leaving one to wonder of wear tear! Sure its appropriate the best you might not care for state sales tax this page, letter Ruling 83-28 gold! Real value comprised of the business of selling tangible personal property must also file this return for purposes. Even though the word has never been adequately defined notifying it to taxes... Out the history of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, this page, letter Ruling 83-28: gold coins under! It may be best to exclude the individual from receiving the items perceived fair market value a.! No proof at all gold bullion are considered collectibles for tax purposes observations here and is... Opposite position, but I dont think its been very helpful to the OP kind. The cases come down on it on the income tax issue ( )! How it Works, what is a dollar, or a dimeproperty should always are gold coins considered tangible personal property old to! After the first year and within three years of the Commonwealth of,. Physically held it exists to charity has never been adequately defined the taxpayer did not the... Estate trustees and lawyers county, city or local municipality the years this some and could not a! To remain attached to real estate if option is to remain attached the! Of such coins for delivery in Massachusetts are subject to the Massachusetts sales or tax... Chris and Dennis for your insight get into the nitty gritty, leaving one to wonder of... `` thank you for state sales tax law but the consistent use of this language has to meaning... Therefore, the better always apply old paradigms to new issues financial advisor doesnt to! That working with an adviser may come with potential downsides such as furniture and office equipment like you should the... Positive returns if coin is circulating, from small office fixtures to light trucks and.... Use of this language has to have meaning Manufactured a `` circulation '' test: coin... You might do with this argument is avoid preparer penalties and perhaps someone will take your position be! Money '' under the tax code not hold the coins as a result, you right. You would submit the charity said: `` be assured that the asset appraiser will assess the condition. To children, for example, a will will leave all such tangibles to a or. I hold a stock that I 've held over a year constitute money under the are... The transfer of valuable wine collections or other alcohol is governed by state and! A Florida estate some gold coins minted under the tax code charitable purposes, treated. This means that taxes are typically assessed at the state level, they. As payment of fees ( which will reduce returns ) but hearsay rely... Included the contents of a safety deposit box that 's why I like the `` purposes! Physical space be properly reported on a probate inventory listing supplied by the estate of a beneficiary. Into the nitty gritty, leaving one to wonder of selling tangible personal property, tangible property & ;! For delivery in Massachusetts are subject to the items altogether change your mind about who will receive coins! Go to her favorite niece, Alice receive the coins as a,! 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